3/15/06

HOST_Carolann: I think we will get started. It's the top of the hour and we should get our session under way!
HOST_Carolann: Welcome again everyone! And a special welcome to Rebekah Montgomery who is our guest speaker for today.
HOST_Carolann: She is going to help us think about Questions We Ask God About Pain and Answers We Can Expect.
HOST_Carolann: Rebekah is from Illinois and is a published author, Bible teacher and well known speaker despite the challenges of her Parkinsons-like illness.
HOST_Carolann: Welcome Rebekah, and I will turn our time over to you.
Rebekah_Montgomery: thank you, Carolann. I type with one hand and I'm a little slow.
Rebekah_Montgomery: at typing that is...lol
HOST_Carolann: that's quite OK, we will be patient
HOST_Carolann: we knew what you meant!
Rebekah_Montgomery: One of the main questions we are tempted to ask God is Why He has allowed a time of testing in our lives
Rebekah_Montgomery: but people are often afraid He'll be peeved if we question Him
Rebekah_Montgomery: but quite the contrary is true.
Rebekah_Montgomery: He actually wants us to ask
Rebekah_Montgomery: in James 1, He said, If you lack wisdom, ASK. He gives wisdom liberally
Rebekah_Montgomery: and doesn't get angry about our questioning
Rebekah_Montgomery: But He does want us to ask follow up questions: such as What? What are we to do with the pain and trouble in our lives?
Rebekah_Montgomery: What good can I bring out of this?
Rebekah_Montgomery: I think we're afraid to ask Him question because we've told we're not SUPPOSED to question. But that is simply not Biblical.
Rebekah_Montgomery: Paul had some sort of physical affliction and he questioned God about it. God didn't get angry but told him specifically why he had it.
Rebekah_Montgomery: It seems Paul was a bit cocky and prone to pride. And God had given him some spiritual visions.
Rebekah_Montgomery: His physical afflictions were to keep him humble. Imagine: A man who preached that God could heal having a physical affliction. Very humbling.
Rebekah_Montgomery: So the beginning question we can ask is "Why?" We may not get an answer immediately or in this life, but we can ask.
Rebekah_Montgomery: God won't fall off His throne in a dead faint if we ask Him why we must suffer this particular illness or affliction.
Rebekah_Montgomery: Now you all can jump in here with questions, too, if you have them.
Rebekah_Montgomery: Otherwise I'm going to write a book!
HOST_Carolann: I'm enjoying "your book" so far!
Rebekah_Montgomery: Thanx! In preparation for this, and to find some answers for myself, I've studied the questions David asked God.
Rebekah_Montgomery: Sometime, start at the beginning of Psalms and read thru the questions David poses to God about his own problems.
Rebekah_Montgomery: The questions sound so familiar. I've wanted to sit down with God and ask Him those things myself.
Margie: That is a good idea.
HOST_Carolann: David certainly asked "why" alot and you could just feel his sorrow and pain sometimes
Alice: So, as a HK facilitator, if my people ask me "why God would allow them to go through this and that -- what should my answer be?
Rebekah_Montgomery: The answer is as individual as the person.
Margie: Interestingly, God did not answer David directly, it seems David answered his own questions, am I correct?
Rebekah_Montgomery: There is not one answer that fits every person.
Rebekah_Montgomery: Sometimes, God DID answer David directly. Sometimes, he said "SIN" in the case of the child conceived with Bathsheba. Sometimes, David had to be stirred to act against a wrong.
Rebekah_Montgomery: Sometimes the illness or the affliction was to bring about change. Sometimes, these things are to get us talking to God.
HOST_Carolann: Unfortunately we seem to do the opposite and run away from God in anger
Rebekah_Montgomery: C S Lewis said: Pain is God's megaphone.
Alice: I have found that anything I go through is used for God's glory -- and He will use my issues for "HIS purposes" I might not always know how He chooses to use them.
HOST_Carolann: amen Alice
Rebekah_Montgomery: Eventually, after the rage or the tantrum, there's no where else to go.
HOST_Carolann: that's true
Rebekah_Montgomery: That is where we ask for wisdom.
Rebekah_Montgomery: Dear God, what am I to do with this affliction?
Rebekah_Montgomery: There are lessons learned in times of pain that are not learned anywhere else.
HOST_Carolann: that is SO true
Mary_Lou: That's good advice, Rebekah. For a long time, I asked God to remove the affliction when he really wanted me to ask him what I was supposed to learn from him IN the affliction.
Rebekah_Montgomery: Amen.
HOST_Carolann: I think Mary Lou, that's our "natural" response - to just get rid of it
Mary_Lou: And sadly, I was in a church where they thought that, if I had enough faith I'd be healed. That kind of mindset prevents us from seeking God in the affliction, doesn't it?
Mary_Lou: We chase the healing rather than the healer.
Alice: Lisa Copen says in one of her books or whatever that sometimes it is helpful to pray, not to be healed, but to be healed from the need to be healed.
Rebekah_Montgomery: When my son died, I waited for some sort of devotional thought that would heal my soul. After all, that happens in all the stories you read. When that didn't happen,
Rebekah_Montgomery: I got really angry with God.
Rebekah_Montgomery: and felt gypped.
Rebekah_Montgomery: The emotional pain had to run its natural course.
Rebekah_Montgomery: But in the quiet after the storm, I discovered that God had taught me a tenderness
Rebekah_Montgomery: and compassion for others I couldn't - wouldn't have learned any other way.
Rebekah_Montgomery: And sometimes He answers the questions of why after we stop screaming in pain and anger.
Rebekah_Montgomery: What questions have you asked and what answers has God given some of the rest of you?
Margie: Physical pain almost seems to shrink away, when one thinks of the emotional pain of losing a child. I cannot imagine.
HOST_Carolann: me either Margie, it must be unbearable
A_Ron: sometimes we need to go through the pain so that others can see how we handle the pain.
A_Ron: if we confess a faith in Christ
HOST_Carolann: that's a good point Ron, never thought of that
Alice: I agree, Ron
Rebekah_Montgomery: Quite right. The world needs to see how a Christian handles pain and loss.
Elaine: To answer your question Rebekah, I have been asking for a long long time and I don't feel I've had ANY answers--I've been told that no answer is an answer--does that make sense?
Laura: I don't know that we will ever fully understand the "why" until we get to heaven
HOST_Carolann: I have asked the question why me, which I guess is really the same as why. I just wonder why God "picks on" me
Mary_Lou: When I asked God why he hadn't healed me while others have been healed, he answered in a way I couldn't imagine. He made me feel what HE feels at my pain and I have never felt such tremendous sorrow in my life.
Mary_Lou: And I realized that Jesus had felt every stabbing pain, every tingle, every emotional sorrow, etc. that I had felt.
Laura: I thought for sure God would heal me because I had four small sons to raise. It is now ten years later and I realize he allowed me to raise them with his strength.
momof3handsomeboys: I once had someone say to me that there must a lesson that I had not learned yet and that's why I still wasn't healed. But that same night the Lord showed me through a devotional that is just like Ron says is for those to see our faith in Him and how she pulls through
A_Ron: God "picks" on those He know can handle it. Not given anymore than we can handle
HOST_Carolann: I came to realise that Ron, yes, eventually, thankfully
Rebekah_Montgomery: There is a fascinating scene in Revelations where those who have been martyred rise up from their sleep and ask Why God hasn't avenged their blood. Even in heaven, all questions aren't answered until the end of time when Jesus wipes away all tears. The full answer isn't simple.
Mary_Lou: I have come to the point where I realize that God isn't picking on me. He has given me the honour of entering into a deeper relationship than I ever had when I was healthy.
HOST_Carolann: amen Mary Lou
Mary_Lou: That honour just happens to come hand-in-hand with suffering.
Laura: I still wonder why God heals so many but not me
Mary_Lou: Sometimes it's hard for us to understand how God's perfect love can go along with pain, but it does.
A_Ron: yes indeed ML
Mary_Lou: Personally, God has used pain to draw me to him, to make me learn to go to him for all things.
Mary_Lou: I used to give him lip-service, but lived my life independent of him, thinking I could do everything in my own strength.
Mary_Lou: He used suffering to teach me that it's better to be weak and live in his strength than live in a shallow relationship with him, doing things my way in my own strength.
Mary_Lou: He has also used suffering to increase my faith as I see him at work more and more in my life.
Elaine: Mary_Lou, why do you suppose that doesn't happen with all who suffer?
momof3handsomeboys: Not everyone has their focus in Him
Mary_Lou: That's a good question, Elaine. As Rebekah says, it's different for every person.
Elaine: Rebekah, or Mary_Lou, exactly
HOST_Carolann: not everyone is open to His working in their lives or being open to the answer God has for us - we want the answer we want
Elaine: sorry, exactly "what" is different?
Mary_Lou: I didn't learn Christ's lessons for me in the midst of pain until I stopped looking at what I wanted for me and started looking at what he wanted for me.
Laura: Do you ever wonder why God fills us with so many gifts and talents but yet you're physically unable to use them?
A_Ron: physically unable to use your gifts and talents, but you can still encourage others with similar gifts and talents
Mary_Lou: I didn't learn his lessons until, as Rebekah says, I asked him specifically.
Mary_Lou: And, even more important, I was actually willing to listen to what he said and act on it.
Margie: I can relate to the "picking on me " because I have multiple illnesses. This level of suffering has often brought me close to the breaking point. Suffering is not a spiritual joyride to me - it is hard work to stay the course.
Elaine: Margie, so true... very hard work.
Mary_Lou: You ask what is "different", Elaine? All of us have a unique relationship with Christ.
Mary_Lou: The lessons I needed to learn about self-reliance and leaning on the Lord may not be lessons that someone else needs to learn.
Mary_Lou: So while he used pain to teach me what I need to learn, he will use pain to teach someone else something entirely different because what they need to learn is different than what I need to learn.
Mary_Lou: Does that make sense?
Laura: I am bed-ridden so I feel isolated and unable to give as I would like
Margie: Laura, I am semi-bedridden so I understand..
Mary_Lou: As for having talents and not having the physical ability to use them, I struggle with that, too.
Mary_Lou: But the thing is, I used to use my talents for my own glory, not God's.
HOST_Carolann: But God knows that Laura and you're not "failing Him" but not being able to use your talents He gave you because of your illness
Mary_Lou: I am now learning to turn the gifts God has given me over to the Lord for him to use through me.
Mary_Lou: In other words, I am letting him show me what to do with those talents and learning to give him the glory.
Mary_Lou: I am a writer by trade. But I lost the ability to write by hand or type at one point in my life.
momof3handsomeboys: I can also relate to the gifts and not being able to use them. I once was a member of a church that would not let me serve because of my illness
HOST_Carolann: that's sad mom3 - our churches sometimes fail us that way
kp: Unfortunately I don't think that I have learned what I could have through pain - because I tended to right from the start look for ways to blame myself rather than question things elsewhere
Mary_Lou: What good is a writer who can't get her words down on paper?
Rebekah_Montgomery: Not everyone is at the same place. Sometimes the pain is overwhelming. Sometimes the frustration is ... well, frustrating. But our lives and our talents are His to give and take and use and not use, as He wishes.
Mary_Lou: As I grew closer to God and became more interested in his will for my life and giving him the glory and less interested in having everybody congratulate me for writing something good, he gradually gave me back the ability to get words on paper.
Mary_Lou: But I still can't spend the amount of time I would like to write without it increasing my pain considerably.
Mary_Lou: So that's my story!
Margie: Mary Lou I understand, I once was an avid Journal keeper.
Laura: I love to sing, work with children, visit the elderly. stuff like that, but God has given me an outlet and ministry through writing which has been my saving grace
Mary_Lou: It's a terrible thing NOT to be able to do what you love. But it's a more terrible thing to do what you love and NOT allow the Lord to be part of it.
HOST_Carolann: well said Mary Lou!
Mary_Lou: That is the lesson the Lord taught me through pain and suffering.
Margie: Now, I keep a praise and thanks journal, and write down a line at a time.
Margie: I have found this to be more content rich than my former ramblings!
Mary_Lou: Good for you, Margie!
Mary_Lou: I don't write as much as I used to, but I'd like to think that I have quality if not quantity with my writing.
Laura: But what is tough for me is that I was on a path of doing what I loved for the Lord already before I was struck with a spinal injury
Alice: Mary Lou -- thank you for sharing. You said all the things I feel -- and it all goes back to the point of, we go through whatever "so God can be glorified!"
Mary_Lou: I don't know about your situation, Laura. The only thing that comes to mind is this: Were you doing what you loved to do for the Lord because you wanted to do it or because the Lord wanted you to do it?
Laura: I have read your poetry Mary Lou, as well as your devotions and they are very good!
Mary_Lou: Sometimes we can do what we think the Lord wants and not be doing what he wants at all. That's the way I was.
Mary_Lou: But that may not necessarily apply to you, Laura.
Mary_Lou: Thank you, Laura!
Mary_Lou: And thank you for your comment earlier, Alice.
Mary_Lou: I'm sorry. I didn't mean to monopolize the conversation! I'll give others a turn now!
HOST_Carolann: that's quite all right Mary Lou - it's all be a discussion on our topic for today
Laura: I really felt called to have a ministry for the hurting people in hospitals and felt my heart was truly seeking God .
A_Ron: This is a good place to start Laura, there are many hurting people who come into this chatroom looking for comfort and hope, but there is no one here
Margie: Laura, maybe God has called you to have a ministry for the hurting via phone or computer. Now, you have real life experience in hurting.
Laura: I think so too, I have poetry and childrens books now that I think will end up in hospital rooms to bring joy and comfort
Rebekah_Montgomery: I want to leave you with a thought about Paul's thorn in the flesh: Paul had a similar situation. He longed to preach but was a prisoner in Rome under house arrest. He was losing his eyesight so he had to dictate letters to the churches, letters we call the Epistles.
HOST_Carolann: Rebekah - some of what you said got cut off
Rebekah_Montgomery: We have to dream God's dreams for us.
Rebekah_Montgomery: Our afflictions and pain are part of His plan to bring about something
HOST_Carolann: Thank you so much Rebekah for sharing with us today and for helping us to think about these good questions
HOST_Carolann: thank you all for adding your insights too and for sharing your experiences
Rebekah_Montgomery: Live into the questions. Don't be afraid of the Answer.
momof3handsomeboys: For me it has been fun to join this chat and see that there are Christians out there going through the same things I go. God Bless
HOST_Carolann: That's so key Rebekah, thank you and God bless you in your ministry
Mary_Lou: Thank you, Rebekah! God bless you for sharing God's truth with us today!
Rebekah_Montgomery: You are welcome! You've all been a blessing to me!
Margie: Thank you Rebekah.
Elaine: Thank you Rebekah
Alice: Thanks everyone. Especially Rebekah, Carolann, and Mary Lou. Bye for now.
HOST_Carolann: I appreciate all you had to say to us
A_Ron: Thanks from a parkie downunder